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Posted by Brandon Sandman Bell on Thursday August 14, 2008 - 11:28 PM

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» PhysX Performance Update: GPU vs. PPU vs. CPU

After posting our PhysX story last week, many of you wrote in asking for PPU benchmarks, so today we've delivered! Armed with our original BFG PhysX card, we booted up an X48 Core 2 QX9650 testbed and re-ran the benchmarks. See how the PPU fared against the CPU and GPU in this quick article!

>> Click Here to read the article

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15 User Comment(s) • 7 root comment(s)
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Click to view thinkingman's User Page thinkingman (1)  Talk to thinkingman in the Shout! Box Aug 18, 2008 - 03:47 am
» The obvious question!!!
OK, so nVidia cards run PhysX better than dedicated PhysX cards and CPUs.

But the obvious question that everyone seems to have missed is:

What if I install say an 8800GT as a 2nd stand alone gfx card (just for PhysX use) in my ATI 4850 equipped machine?

Is there a reason it shouldn't work?

What would the benchmarks be like?

I have an old machine here with an AGP ATI 9800 AIW with a PCI nVidia card that powers a 2nd monitor. Works fine. So why not mix GPU manufacturers with PCI-E cards?

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Click to view GX-Brandon's User PageI am an AMD Agent GX-Brandon (369)  Talk to GX-Brandon in the Shout! Box I am an AMD Agent Aug 19, 2008 - 02:40 pm
I asked NVIDIA this question and never got a response. Therefore my guess is this isn't something they're working on at the moment.

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Click to view soydeedo's User Page soydeedo (157)  Click to view soydeedo's User Profile Talk to soydeedo in the Shout! Box Aug 16, 2008 - 11:48 pm
Thanks for the update, Brandon. =)

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Click to view SuperG's User Page SuperG (22)  Talk to SuperG in the Shout! Box Aug 16, 2008 - 05:36 am
I don't agree on a few point in the conlusion
For me the performance was as expected. All those game where made with a PhysX load for PPU1 in mind.
PPU was ment back then for enthausiast gamers. Like me, currious about it, spend 2 times €233( == $350 orso)to give it a spin. In decent game rigs. A PPU make sense in a high-end game rig at that time. A fast CPU and Gcard so PPU get its time slice per frame to do it's thing and that not FPS but much more Physics then normal.

CPU gaind in time more computing power but not neer PPU1. So Dedicated PhysX made sense. But there wasn't a tripl A Highprofile game using PPU power. To push it hard in the market.
UT3 was late and not a dedicated PhysX game. But trough mods.

For hardware that’s over two years old,
it's 125 mil low clocked transistors on 130nm. Don't match against high clocked shader array of 350+ mil transistors. 1/4 or 1/8 of its shaders could match a PPU. And that is more realistics. It's a old 130nm 125Mil transistor chip. VS a 680Mill 65/55nm chip.

It would be the 8 world wonder if it did match the performance of today’s GeForce 8800 GT and 9800 GTX cards. Because ppu logic must be like 400% more effective then a unified shader.

For me it make no sense to buy a 2 year old Chip now, witch would be normaly replaced by somthing more powerfull. PPU isn't replaced by PPU2 but G8x/G92/GT200 produkts. In a dedicated and non dedicated form.

So by now I would buy a PPU2, but instead something from nV as PhysX doesn't come for free as this review and conlusion will make you believe it comes with a cost. As long if you have a overkill of shader power. you never notice this cost and it will look likes if it comes for free.

Buying a PPU now is like buying a 6800 or dualcore. Old dated and bypassed by newer stuff.

A g92 give only better performance if the card has a overkill of shader for particular game and its game settings. It can be used for more than just PhysX. I would put two G92+ in sLI. To get the most out of rendering and PhysX.
It's also nice that ATI with PPU will do to for current PhysX games.
I won't expect that nextgen PhysX game will use a high-end dedicated GPU PhysX load. Thus PPU could do for a much longer time.
As dev's have now a target audience of some very litle to zero to very much spare shaders power with single gPU configurations. And also optional dedicated low to high-end G-cards for sLI and multiGPU gamers.
PhysX in game would need just like rendering a very large Option screen. with a lot of check boxes and sliders. Not many dev will go for that. So they pick a few mainstream PhySX load paths with a few optional settings.

For Physics it's becoming a very interresting time. But it all depends if the dev's will pick it up. And use it to it's full potention.

I wonder if some dev will implement setting to optional stress a full dedicated GT200B

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Click to view tanclearas's User Page tanclearas (2)  Talk to tanclearas in the Shout! Box Aug 15, 2008 - 06:12 pm
» What about using lower-end cards for PhysX?
I am curious about how well some of the dirt-cheap cards are at PhysX. I'm thinking about 8400/8500/9500 series cards. I've seen some selling as low as $40, and can probably find a fanless model for not much more.

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Click to view GX-Brandon's User PageI am an AMD Agent GX-Brandon (369)  Talk to GX-Brandon in the Shout! Box I am an AMD Agent Aug 16, 2008 - 11:53 am
I doubt anything below a 9600 GT would be faster than the PPU. Keep in mind though that a 9600 GT is a ~$100 card, and even today the PPU at best sells for $120.

So the cards you suggested are all cheaper than buying a PPU.

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Click to view Lidale's User PageI am an AMD Agent Lidale (309)  Talk to Lidale in the Shout! Box I am an AMD Agent Aug 17, 2008 - 02:29 am
Bad logic, since the PPU + Card specs were actually lower then Cuda. This is also only for physx enabled games like the special maps on UT3. Thsoe $150 physx cards are proven inferior~ even to a lower end 8000 or 9000 series.

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Click to view SuperG's User Page SuperG (22)  Talk to SuperG in the Shout! Box Aug 16, 2008 - 04:48 am
Well the conclusion and testbed doesn't take a opinion on that. There is no GPU scaling. Also limmited render setting used.
Also the game tested are only a few and based on the same engine.
U3 engine is Fillrate depending and most of those game arent pushing the limits with GFX. So even a G92(+) Have enough spare shader to do PhysX to.

However low to midrange card needs there shaders harder for rendering. For shader depending games even more so.
Such situation wil give a very low PhysX performance win. While PPU as it is dedicated keeps strong. Just like a extra Gcard with all its shaders dedicated for PhysX would even outperforme PPU. But only more the game is PhysX dependand.
A Other review of CPU vs PPU vs GPU showed that.

by just putting the render setting a lot higher. The game get more GPU dependand and FPS will drop.

Now a new heavy PHYSX DX10 shader heavy game.
Heaving two G92 or single GT200 make more sense.

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Click to view Eye of the Night's User Page Eye of the Night (351)  Talk to Eye of the Night in the Shout! Box Aug 15, 2008 - 04:20 pm
Very interesting comparison. Although I had expected the PPU card to fare better - maybe there is some limitation in the bus speed in play, here - as the speed with PPU is about equal for all the different GPU's.

Would it be possible to set up something really heavy, that would drop the frame rate in the tests to 20 or lower with physics calculations alone?

It's not sure whether GPU performance is due to raw power, or to lack of communication limitations.

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